Romans 6:6

Thursday, May 25, 2006

τουτο D-ASN γινωσκοντες V-PAP-NPM
knowing this
οτι CONJ ο T-NSM παλαιος A-NSM ημων P-1GP ανθρωπος N-NSM συνεσταυρωθη V-API-3S
that our old man was crucified with him
..................................ινα CONJ καταργηθη V-APS-3S το T-NSN σωμα
..................................N-NSN της T-GSF αμαρτιας N-GSF του T-GSM
..................................in order that the body of sin may be brought
..................................to nothing
..................................μηκετι ADV δουλευειν V-PAN ημας P-1AP
..................................τη T-DSF αμαρτια N-DSF
..................................and henceforth we should not serve sin

Moo differs in his understanding of this verse from the other commentators and translators. I am not in agreement with his understanding of the verb συνεσταυρωθη used here in this verse, where he equates it with the definite and final death of Christ as result of the crucifixion. I disagree because the finality of the death of Christ is portrayed by his burial (v.4).

I feel we need to understand how they take to crucifixion in the time of Paul. In Jesus’ time, it was the most shameful and painful way to die – and I believe that view would not have changed by much in Paul’s time, in comparison to our present time.

Taking that into consideration, would Paul be referring to the way Jesus died in suffering and shame that our old self should also be crucified in shame and in pain? For it is indeed in shame that we admit to our sins and die to it; and it is in pain that we renounce our old ways which we have become so accustomed to.

Moo also commented that when Paul refers to “our old man”, ο παλαιος ημων ανθρωπος, Paul does not refer to the two parts of the life of a believer – his old nature and his new nature, but to the person as a whole, the entire corporate structure to which he belongs.

This is thought-provoking for me because one, it seem to be in the same line of argument of being “dead to sin”: if the whole old man has died, and the new man now exist in Christ, what then our weaknesses to sin? And two, what about Eph 4:22-24, where Paul commands Christians to “put off the old man” and “put on the new man”, implying that as Christians, we may still have our old nature lying around, which we need to discard in order to be like Christ?

Looks like it's a more-on-Romans 6:6 tomorrow.

Maeghan


Addendum: The "tomorrow" I promised

Behind the contrast between "the old man" and "the new man" is the contrast between Adam and Christ, those who are in Adam exist in the old man and those who are in Christ exist in the new man. In Moo's opinion, it is only by interpreting it this way that we are able to intergrate two apparent conflicting viewpoints in Paul. Where Col 3:9-11 make clear that the believer has ceased to be the old man and has become new man, Eph 4:22-24 commands Christians to put of the old man. And if these phrases look at the person as one who belongs to the old age or the new, respectively, then this conflict is easily resolved. Moo may be right, in that Paul makes it clear that the believer has been transferred from the old age of sin and death to the new age of righteousness and life. The powers of that old age will continue to influence the believer and must be continually resisted - hence the imperatives of Eph 4:22-24. At the heart of the contrast is the eschatological tension between the inauguration of the new age in the life of the believer. What we were in Adam is no more, but until heaven, the temptation to live in Adam always remains. (Moo p.374-5)

How true ... the temptation to live in Adam will always for us remain, and not until heaven is realised for us, we are required to resist and fight, and live a holy life.

Updated Sunday 28th May 2006

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11 comment(s)

  1. Maeghnan,

    How about taking in contrast (well really in context) to this verse:

    Romans 6:23

    For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.


    The power that the 'old man' had over us was death. With the consequence of sin being 'killed' at the cross with Jesus, the 'old man' has nothing to hang over us. We are not subject to sin, so we can walk in the liberty that Christ has afforded us.

    God Bless
    Doug

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  2. Hmm... that is a good way to look at it. Thanks for the insight.
    But don't the old man come back to haunt us and we fall into sin? haha... this debate will never end.

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  3. Maeghan,

    Ahhh yes the circular debate.

    I don't have time to look it up, but somewhere it say that Satan travels to and fro like a toothless lion.

    I look at the old-man in this light. He may try to haunt us, but it is just a roar. His bite has been taken by what Christ did. It is we who allow ourelves to be haunted by him.

    God Bless
    Doug

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  4. You moved on to Rom 6:7 because you didn't get any answers. I don't know if you meant from people who knew something, or from the Peanut Gallery. :-)

    Personally, I was waiting for more "tomorrow".

    The old man is crucified "with" Him. Does the Greek seem interesting here on the "with" like back in v4?

    I think verse 7 explains this verse pretty well, so off to that post.

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  5. Codepoke,
    No, no. I didn't mean I did not get any answers from people but that I did not find any answers myself to the questions even after doing some reading and research.
    I had better change or qualify myself there :)
    I will definitely come back to v.6 later (I have got a Romans 6 paper to do!) and will post it then.

    I think verse 7 explains this verse pretty well, so off to that post.
    yeah ... this becomes a problem when I break them into verse by verse post. they are indeed connected, and not to be seen in isolation.

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  6. codepoke,

    The old man is crucified "with" Him. Does the Greek seem interesting here on the "with" like back in v4?

    Yes, it does, now that you mentioned it. I missed that. It has the same preposition συν that is included in the verb itself.

    Buried with him and crucified with him. Indeed.

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  7. Doug,

    1 Peter 5:8
    Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.


    I look at the old-man in this light. He may try to haunt us, but it is just a roar. His bite has been taken by what Christ did. It is we who allow ourelves to be haunted by him.

    Do you mean that it no longer has power on us? What about our spirit is willing but flesh is weak? It seems like our old self may still have a stong hold sometimes in our lives by evidence of our lack of prayer, lack of priorities, lack of love, prone to anger, prone to hate ...

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  8. codepoke,

    Personally, I was waiting for more "tomorrow".

    I have posted the "tomorrow" :)
    (refer addendum in this same post)

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  9. Maeghan,

    Do you mean that it no longer has power on us?

    Nope, what I am saying is that the power that the old man has over us is what we choose to give him.

    I find that reference in I Peter especially interesting. Roaring lions don't catch much prey: quietly tracking lions do. It is said that lions will sit in the same position for 3 or 4 hours waiting for the opportunity to pounce on their next dinner.

    For a roaring lion to catch you, you must be trapped or stupid. This verse is saying don't be stupid. What Christ did freed us from the traps, but it is up to us not to be stupid.

    God Bless
    Doug

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  10. Maeghan,

    I almost forgot something. There is an American coloquialism that says: 'His bark is worse than his bite'. Its meaning is pretty straight forward: lots of dogs bark like crazy, but they aren't really much of a threat. The bark is intended to drive fear into them, but it really only works if you let it. I look at the old-man in this way too.

    God Bless
    Doug

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  11. Doug,
    Interesting insight about the lion - I never thought of it that way. Indeed, a prowling lion goes undetected. And when we are living in the light, temptation should not be prowling undetected, we should know it because it is not of the light.

    Thanks :)

    A dog's bark worse than his bite eh? I have been chased twice in my life by 2 ferocious dogs ... twice came out fine :) but that's another story (or 2).

    Maeghan

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